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  • Posted by wildwabbit 1 year ago. There are 15 posts. The latest reply is from Phem.

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  1. wildwabbit

    This thread is by know means an attempt to gloat, however I am extremely proud of what my parents have achieved, and the legacy my brother and I will inherit one day. I have only recently become aware of ZM but the idea's are something that I have held at heart most of my adult life.
    I think most people are aware of the American Indian proverb, "We do not inherit the earth from our parents, we borrow it from our children." As a parent of three young children in this twisted world it makes me feel incredibly accountable for everything I contribute to this world. I hope that what my parents have sewn, I can make blossom for the sake my children.

    Upon retirement 10 years ago my parents purchased a 20acre dilapidated and rundown dairy and cottage, with the intent on trying to live out a self sufficient retirement. It is situated on Mitchells Island an estuary connected by bridges which forms part of the Manning River near Taree in N.S.W.
    The farm when they purchased it was in very poor condition, every structure on the place was either in need of repair or beyond. The first couple of years they were there, they did little more than clean up the place and make it livable again. After much demolition and repairing they still have several variously sized sheds and a cottage that resembles a labyrinth, as it had been extended twice by previous owners who put no thought into what they were doing, it is unique to say the least. My parents have bore water for stock and crops, and two 60,000 liter rain (120,000 liters in total) for use in the house, in ten years they have never seen these tanks below 3/4s full. I helped dad install a new kitchen just this xmas, was the final improvement that the place needed.

    From the front gate of "Harmony" as my mother has named the farm, you can walk to the edge of the Manning River which is lined by oyster farms, it is rich in bream, flathead, cod and prawns and if you go far enough up stream closer to Taree you can get bass as well. It is only about 2km downstream from the entrance of my parents farm that you reach Manning Point and the ocean. The beach there is very rough (can hear the waves breaking from the farm at night) and unpatrolled but also a great spot for snapper, whiting and jewfish, I have an uncanny ability to catch stingrays no matter where I throw a line, beach or estuary.

    The location of the land in my opinion is near perfect, it is ex-dairy and hence very fertile land if cared for properly, yet a keen fisherman could exist on the seafood alone all within walking distance of the house.

    My father before he was married spent a portion of his years as a drover, and his dream has always been to raise cattle. They have about a dozen stud heifers and a magnificent stud bull named Trinity (he almost tramples you to death out of affection) the offspring are sold to the markets each year, they don't slaughter their own meat purely because they haven't built a cold room (YET). Originally my mother wanted a milking cow so she could make her own cream and butter, and some pigs too, but they realized that amongst all the other things they do, it would be just too much work. My father has a Clydesdale' named Gracie, and he has a fencing partner named Rufus, a one horned overweight merino that was meant to end up on a Sunday spit roast.

    They have around 50 chooks, the population varies in relation to the local fox population. My mother sells the eggs to the General store and bowls club at Manning Point, which is where my dad gets his used cooking oil to make his own bio-diesel that power his two vintage tractors. My mother uses the glycerin, which is the bi-product to make a variety of soaps, for dish washing, cloths washing and people washing, she is still experimenting with the recipes'

    They have a wood burning stove adjacent the modern kitchen that also doubles as a gravity fed water heater and heater in general. And the cottage has a proper fireplace in the living room.

    To relax, my mother restores antique furniture that she purchases for next to nothing at auctions, her favorites are those that contain stain glass paneling as she a master of making lead light windows and has replaced many windows in the house with work of her own.
    My dad likes to restore vintage machinery, and if coaxed by mum the occasional cast iron bed. The house is an eclectic mix of modern and past times. Beside the computer desk in their office sits a 4' tall grammar-phone that still works (you have to wind it up), with close to a hundred LP's and an old singer sewing machine (the kind you pedal with a foot)

    An area directly behind the house is fenced off from the livestock, there is avocado, peach, orange, guava and grapes and a small vege-patch that is more or less left to fend for itself other than the occasional weeding, none the less, it is completely random and you are able to find almost anything growing in there, my dad always has his own potatoes somewhere though.

    Recently my parents have considered going off the power grid. It is a little bit expensive for them at present. They will not be eligible for any rebates because they wish to go off the grid completely and rebates are only available if you agree to sell your excess to the grid. The area has a great potential for wind power, as there is always a constant breeze blowing in from the ocean. I am presently investigating making our own wind power generator/s, as a cheaper alternative to solar. My dad has so much bio-diesel stored he has seriously considered a diesel gen-set.(would be handy for back up)

    It will be a sad yet proud day when my brother and I take over Harmony, between us we hope to refine and explore more self sufficiency idea's, anyone in the ZM would be more than welcome to come and stay a while.(the hay shed could sleep a hundred no worries) though for now it gives me great pleasure in seeing my parents enjoy themselves, they work hard but love every minute of every day, for a couple approaching 70 they are a testimony to healthy, active, stress free living, neither of them look a day over 50. My only regret is that I am tied to work in larger cites (Brisbane is home at present) and I don't get down to Harmony often enough, and each trip is never long enough to help out as much as i wish I could, although i have felt the last few times I have visited, that Harmony is calling me, as if it were already a part of me.

  2. User has not uploaded an avatar

    Sigh.. Are you serious?

    In many of the interviews with the minds behind the Venus Project, They keep saying building small communities does not work.
    Because the people in them isolate them self's from every one else and become uninformed and foolish as the world changes around them for the worse and no greater good becomes of it.

    A suggestion would be to use solar panels and other things like wind turbines, if you do not know how to build them your self, search on youtube, this is where I learn't from scratch how to build one for my self.

    *Edit* If you require a link for the tutorials then I can provide one.
    http://solartechtown.com/how-to-build-a-solar-panel/

    He does great step by step process, it is long, but its the best I have seen, other's skip parts. Also he has other interesting things like, RC lawn mower

    Don't forget a goal to the Venus project is to free people from labor and servitude not
    to put them deeper into it.

    If you have any other question's about what you should do, or would like to do please ask.

    -Peace
  3. wildwabbit

    Hi Phem,
    I did mention (but not very clearly) that when I eventually take over Harmony that it was my goal to refine things. That basically means streamline, modernise, incorporate technology in its best and most efficient forms. My parents are creating basic infrastructure and doing things their way. I would do a lot of things differently, and some completely different things, but they are happy doing what they do, and I don't want to destroy that simply for my benefit in the future, I suggest idea's and help them with things, but at the end of the day, seeing them happy makes me happy.

    I find it strange that you associate a small community as being isolated and narrow minded rather than a model for bigger and better things or simply something that could be duplicated. Maybe a small community makes most people think of some kind of back to grass roots hippy community, I know that their are plenty of them, and I am aware of the bigger picture. People usually become cut off and ignorant because they want too, or simply do so out of frustration with the rest of the world, and are already predispositioned to uni-bomber syndrome.

    Being on a self sufficient farm wouldn't stop me from using the inter-net, or driving 20 mins into town to buy newer more efficient technology. I could still watch TV(not that I watch much anyway) and catch a plane to the other side of the world to see an expo on the latest greenhouse and hydroponic technology. Self sufficiency doesn't automatically renounce ones ability to integrate with society.

    People think that buy cutting your dependency on the outside world you immediately disenfranchise yourself from it. I believe the inverse is true if you consider that, if you didn't have to pay for water, electricity, food and fuel, and could still work a paying job, you would have a lot more disposable income to invest in expanding?researching?refining? helping others do the same? The biggest question is though, the ratio of self sufficiency to labour? That in a nutshell is my goal, to create/investigate systems of self sustenance that don't impact on lifestyle, ie require a lot of labour.

    As someone who has done physical work most of my life there is lot to be said about not only the physical benefits of labour but also the therapeutic benefits, without trying to sound religious, hard work is good for the soul, it may sound like an oxymoron but hard work can be very relaxing, and also a great vent for negative energy. Please don't forget that our bodies thrive on being active, ( my entire life I have always been of the train of thought that sport and exercise be a waste of energy that could be put to productive use, the human body is the most efficient machine ever designed ) I am by no means a health nut, just something I know well from experience. Vitamin D deficiency is becoming more and more common because people, especially children don't get enough sun. We can create a world with no labour but I think labour is a part of being human, it just depends on how you view it. The idea of the completely automated solar mower has been around for decades, but what if some people enjoy mowing the lawn (therapeutic benefit), and for some people its almost the only exercise and sunlight they get (health benefit), technology can reduce labour, but is reducing an individuals labour beneficial to the individual? Does anyone agree with me on this point?

    Please don't forget that throughout history technology has all so often unknowingly harmed us. I am certainly not anti-technology, just wary of it. Not long after my parents retired my dad was diagnosed with non-hodgkins lymphoma, which is basically cancer of the lymphatic system with the exception of the brain. At my dads age the doctor said there was no point treating the disease as the treatment would do him more harm than the disease. About two years ago the doctor was amazed to find that the disease had completely disappeared, and could only attribute it to his healthy active life style, and the fact that his diet consisted of almost no preservatives, or additives, and was as chemical free as the farm that they live. (a technology free diet, and chemical free habitat )

    I am familiar with both solar and wind power and have deduced that Wind Turbine Axial Flux 3 Phase Alternators produce by far the best bang for your buck. Please don't anyone take offence to what I am about to say but " I just find solar power boring" its just a personal thing, I find the mechanics of a turbine alternator lend itself to an almost infinite variation of props, rotors, alternators magnets, coils, I just find them infinitely more interesting than solar power. If you are prepared to build the alternator/s yourself, and provided you have sufficient wind, and space, it can be much more cost effective to set up. I am investigating at the present, local prevailing winds and the correct most effective turbine set up, a couple of large high output turbines, or many smaller lower output turbines? I want the design to incorporate solar as well at some point, and want the design to be modular so it can be expanded with minimal fuss and expense.

    Anyone interested in knowing about diy wind turbines, below are a couple of good places to start.

    http://www.reuk.co.uk/Wind-Turbine-Alternator-Basics.htm
    http://www.instructables.com/id/DIY-1000-watt-wind-turbine/#step1

    And anyone interested in either solar or wind power the following link is incredibly useful, the tools here will help you calculate your power usage and the size of the system and components throughout the system, even down to the thickness of wires you will need, and the most efficient battery configuration based on your needs.

    http://www.freesunpower.com/designtools.php

  4. dowell

    Hi wildwabbit,
    Thanks for your valuable contribution to the forums, your posts are easy to follow and enjoyable to read. Your Parents sound like very inspiring people, and it seems that has been past on to you.
    I would like to meet you and your parents and see Harmony, and I am happy to help out in any way, I am planning an Aus' tour of as many self-sufficient lifestyles as poss', and at the same time promoting TZM.
    I will be traveling in a self-sufficient as poss' motor home, which is still on the drawing board for now.
    Time and money restaints.

    Anyways, thanks again for your constructive input.

    Be well
    dowell

    earth care, people care and fair share.
  5. wildwabbit

    Hi Dowell,
    I have enjoyed your many posts, as well. I am glad that you find my posts constructive, as that is their intent. Brisbane is in disarray atm, I am fortunate enough to live well away from any flooding, but my job has been temporarily effected, will take me a month or two to get back on financial track. When things return to a degree of normality, would be glad to meet up at some point.

    My parents are always glad to have people stay with them, many of my parents friends and relatives who have now retired, park their caravans, or set up camp for weeks, sometimes months, at the farm. My dads ex-work mates have helped him with numerous projects. A lot my parents is time taken up by repairing or improving the existing infrastructure. Now that the house is complete, they want to demolish the adjoining car sheds and rebuild them, as they are pretty crude structures at present. I am sure when that is finnished, they will find something else to rebuild! Help is always appreciated, and pretty much the only price of staying there.

    I have a reasonably well appointed workshop, so if you require any help or even idea's with your RV I would be glad to help (between work and three kids, time is my biggest enemy though) Pooling resources and knowledge on a practical and local level are an intergral step in the journey. My fathers biodiesel production was only made possible (or in the very least fast tracked) with the help and knowledge of a local friend.

    I am planning on building a prototype wind turbine alternator very soon, once its up and running I will be glad to share what I learn with all. If there is anyone from the electrical field (no pun intended) I would be greatly appreciative if anyone could provide information about a diy 3 phase 12V charge controller, I have come accross a couple of articles online, they are relatively simple devices, but the articles are in terms a little beyond my circuitry knowledge and ability, I need the "for dummies" version. Perhaps there is an electrical engineering student out there who might be able design one from cheap and easy to obtain components.

    P.S. I regrettably threw away a broken direct drive washing machine several months ago. (Before I had begun investigating turbine alternators) The motors (was only the electronics broken in mine) in these washing machines are suitable for use as a wind turbine alternator (rpm and torque input, most existing motors and alternators require too high an rpm to function or require impractical rotor sizes to create the necessary torque for smooth operation) They are not perfect, or the most efficient but still suitable non-the less, if anybody has a broken direct drive washing machine that they are happy to part with let me know, or if you know where I could get one it would be great.

  6. dowell

    Mother nature is merciless, and constainly lets us know who is realy in charge here, I worked with the civil defence in the 74 Floods in Bris, I was living in Highgate hill, that was shocking, but since then the population has greatley increased, so many more are affected. All you can do is clean up and learn better ways to deal with natural calamities, even if it means moving to higher ground.

    I have a busy year ahead so I will keep in touch with you on the trip to Harmony, RV etc. I recently gave away a Mieli front loader washer, a bearing has since failed, so I may still be able to recover the motor if it is at all suitable for your project.

  7. dowell

    We cant not let this be our future

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  8. User has not uploaded an avatar

    I find it strange that you associate a small community as being isolated and narrow minded rather than a model for bigger and better things or simply something that could be duplicated. Maybe a small community makes most people think of some kind of back to grass roots hippy community, I know that their are plenty of them, and I am aware of the bigger picture. People usually become cut off and ignorant because they want too, or simply do so out of frustration with the rest of the world, and are already predispositioned to uni-bomber syndrome.

    People in them stop communicating with outside idea's that contradict their's and so they stick with what they know, who they know, and refuse all other idea's.
    We need to get past this to see the future more clearly. You really see this in most small towns.
    I have lived in a few smaller towns so I have seen/experienced this first hand.

    As for the RC lawn mower just a fun little thing,

    In my line of thinking, it would good to get it planned if you don't it will turn out just like the cities we have now.

    /------/
    Find a large area scope out all aspects of the area and map it out,
    map out region's around the area, To be ready always for growth.
    study all past and future weather patterns for said area's,
    have set idea's for where and how can be developed.

    -home
    -surige
    -food production
    -Comunications
    -workshop(s)
    -water storage
    -power generation
    -power storage (major issue)
    -tree plantation area (for wood productions)
    -School blocks
    -Large meeting area
    -recreational area's

    In the way's I think a multi story under ground system for hydroponic food would be a good way to go, using less land space for more homes or other things.

    A better way in my opinion is to build things on the site that can be sold to the
    "old world" be it food, chairs, tables, machines, solar panels.
    The "funds" then could be used to improve the area's and the lives of all in the area.

    Your theory of hard work is good for the body,
    is not the way of thinking in the Venus Project.
    It is about Freeing us from such things and the ways to do so.

    This in relation to the Venus Project, this would not be taken away if you wanted to build some thing your self, every material or any thing you needed could be provided for you as it is a free society,
    but i would imagine by then that we would be wanting other things from life

    So we should be looking to provide that, and further,

    Communications via the internet:
    As for this every one will need it, if you are in a rural area being built,
    the cheapest way is satellite, so every one will need a dish, schooling area's will need it, network wi-fi could be installed if a large dish providing high speed internet to all people in the area, but that will only do a smaller area,
    and be less effective when people in mass use it.
    So then there could be piggy backing internet from home to home.

    In final summation:
    I want your dreams of/for this land to come true, But I cannot help if you
    just plain reject idea's without reason's other than you don't believe in it.
    (from solar)
    A lot of planning will need to be done, but most importantly focusing on what
    the Venus project... Project's more thinking on this needs to be done by every one,
    Jacque did not wake up one day and have all the design's in his head,
    It took time, We should do by example and carry on in this way but even further.

    -Peace.

    *Edit*
    As I read my final summation I felt bad about being a bit hypocritical so I will be releasing the work I have been doing for a website based community network soon.

  9. wildwabbit

    Hi again Phem,
    I enjoy your constructive criticism, it gives me a chance to express my idea's further, as I tend to feel you assume too much about things. I am a carpenter/builder, I have worked on projects from bridges to highrises,modular precast structures, and mining plants. I would hate to think that you would you think I have not put much thought into things.

    Every new project I work on, gives me more and more idea's about creating not only structures but infra-structure within the structures that employ the most modern and efficient technology, that can range from construction methods, materials, design of things such as electrical, ventilation, water, waste management and data. I have put a lot of thought into things I would like to do in the future. I have always had an obsession with functionality and design, and probably one of the key factors in development is the built in ability for flexibility of purpose, you would be surprised how many new building have an amount of unconnected service systems and networks installed, mostly wiring and or conduct simply because the designers have said that it will be useful in the future if the purpose of the building or technology is changed. You just never know what technological revolution is around the next corner, or even what problems may exist down the track. Flexibility allows integration of new technology and also broadens the opportunity to solve problems.

    A multi-storey underground hydroponics is a novel idea, but I just don't think it is practical as plants need light, and you would need a huge amount of energy just for light alone. If you were using solar power all that space you just saved underground would be consumed by solar panels above ground. ( I know I'd rather be looking at plants) I have no doubt that a system could work, and work efficiently, but shortage of space has never been a real issue, of the TVP, it is more about land use and delegation. With our current farming and distribution methods only about 10% of the worlds food supplies are actually consumed. Food cultivation for TVP would be much more efficient than current methods and there would be little if none wasted, vastly reducing the amount of space require for cultivation, don't forget that plants have athetic value too, would be a shame to hide them underground.

    I'm sorry that you are unable to correlate physical activity with well being. I am suggesting that labor be both beneficial and productive. It seems logical to me that some forms of labor/recreation (depends on how you view it) by choice could be incorporated into a modern society, purely for health and therapeutic benefit. I guess this can only make sense if you believe exercise is essential to a healthy well being, and I am not sure if you do ? As an example to what I am saying is, instead of someone going to the gym for an hour to keep fit, it might be more productive if they went to the local orchard and picked fruit for an hour, who knows they might even enjoy it?

    I have not rejected the idea of solar power, in fact I think it is sensational, and did say that I would like to incorporate it into the wind turbine system I am looking at. But.....like All things it is the cost, that draws me towards wind power, I am sorry that saying I find solar power boring in comparison has made you think otherwise, I was simply saying that from a design point of view wind turbines are more exciting for me.

    I am still astounded that small communities instill a fear of isolation for you. Some communities do this but usually because that is their intent, its there way of saying FTW I can't change it so I won't be a part of it. If I were of this line of thinking I would not be on here sharing my views.

    It is not hard to sit back and dream, to have great idea's and knowledge, its the doing it part that most people just don't get around to. We all have our interpretation of the big dream, but unless you have a few billion dollars to spare then the reality is that smaller dreams are going to be the stepping stones for now

  10. wildwabbit

    Hi dowell,
    thanks for the washing machine motor offer, i'm not an expert on washing machines, but to the best of my knowledge if the motor shaft is attached directly to the bowl then it should be suitable, if it incorporates belts or gears then it is most likely unsuitable. If its any trouble you don't need to bother, I shouldn't have too much trouble locating one, most of my plans are on hold at the moment because I have been unable to work because of the floods. Thanks for the offer, and only if its no trouble, I am in no rush at present.

    cheers

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